tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4598228705498900088.post3564866632233656675..comments2024-03-12T07:54:08.013+00:00Comments on Offerimus Tibi Domine: No Popery here please, we're British.Fr Simon Henryhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05375804232895565241noreply@blogger.comBlogger10125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4598228705498900088.post-31791767590413720382012-04-14T14:33:30.815+01:002012-04-14T14:33:30.815+01:00I wonder how all this came about? Hmm!I wonder how all this came about? Hmm!Sixupmanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12486627001579821658noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4598228705498900088.post-24344268619141169582012-04-12T21:26:22.278+01:002012-04-12T21:26:22.278+01:00Now Father, tell us how you really feel... Just ki...Now Father, tell us how you really feel... Just kidding!<br /><br />You are so right. However, the problem I see is with many bishops. Even if a PP wants to enforce orthodoxy, rubrical correctness and eliminate much of the abuses that have crept into parochial matters, in many cases he cannot count on the backing of his bishop. That is the real nub of the problem.<br /><br />We have had some instances of this here in the US - San Antonio and Philadelphia, to mention but two. <br /><br />Then there is the case of the Austrian PP who refused to seat an openly homosexual man living in a 'committed homosexual relationship' on the Parish Council. He was over-ruled by Cdl. Schonborn and has now resigned from the parish.<br /><br />It is a sad state of affairs when a parish priest cannot count on the 'Father of the Diocese' to support orthodoxy and orthopraxis.GORhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14313101159848740722noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4598228705498900088.post-67433202928695651962012-04-12T21:07:40.678+01:002012-04-12T21:07:40.678+01:00Kinga,
you raise valid points which underline th...Kinga,<br /><br />you raise valid points which underline the great value of the priests we have.<br /><br />Consequently if a proper-minded and orthodox priest wants to run his parish according to good mainstream Catholic practise, and this attracts flak from the busybodies, and possibly his bishop, he could always offer to move over to FSSP?<br /><br />Personally, I think it's time we grasped the nettle and closed parishes to a level to meet the supply of priests.<br /><br />In fairness to priests, who carry the responsibility for parishioners, we should not ask them to look after two or even three parishes. One is more than enough.<br /><br />As for the argument that this will deny Mass to people, well that is going to happen sooner or later. <br /><br />Personally I can drive to at least eight parishes within half an hour and walk to four, maybe six, no, I'm boasting, and there are many in that position. <br /><br />No further comment!Jacobinoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4598228705498900088.post-19947164698157610792012-04-12T21:05:12.392+01:002012-04-12T21:05:12.392+01:00Dear Kinga,
My point about extraordinary ministers...Dear Kinga,<br />My point about extraordinary ministers and in particular "Eucharistic Services" is that they must abide by the existing rules govening these things.Fr Simon Henryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05375804232895565241noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4598228705498900088.post-3703598946424699742012-04-12T19:24:00.149+01:002012-04-12T19:24:00.149+01:00Father
It is a fair point that you make in your c...Father<br /><br />It is a fair point that you make in your comments. However, think about this:<br /><br />Twenty years ago we had PPs with Curates. All seemed well. The sick in hospitals, homes and at home were visited by the PP or by the Curate and received Holy Communion and the Sacraments. <br /><br />Holy Communion was distributed by the Celebrant and the other Priest who was waiting in the wings.<br /><br />Now - we have a Priesthood who is mostly over the age of 45 upto 92.<br /><br />Curates are dreams of the past. The sick and housebound only see the PP when they request Confession or the Sacrament of the Sick.<br /><br />Many PPs have two or three parishes to govern. Bleeps for hospitals, bleeps to HMS Prisons. Schools to visit. Confessions to hear.<br /><br />Meetings associated with the Curia must be attended by Deans or Sub -Deans - almost always held in Liverpool.<br /><br />All of this takes time and there is still only 24 hours in one day.<br /><br />There will be four Ordinations to the Sacred Priesthood in Summer of this year. That is it!<br /><br />Where Mass cannot be celebrated by a Priest because of all these other commitments, then it is inevitable that you will see Liturgy of The Word, more and more.<br /><br />With all the extra work of the Reordering of the Sacraments and the great age of many of the Priests - you cannot expect that the precious Priests whom we have can do any more than they are already doing.<br /><br />My statement applies to those Priests who really do work hard and not to the few that avoid work - by making themselves look busy but actually doing very little but having a multitude of holidays.<br /><br />As for the laity. We try and help the PP, each bringing the mix skills that we have gained in life's experiences.<br /><br />Those people who think that they are indespensible - well there are cementaries full of people who thought they were.<br /><br />As for lay people conducting funerals - well who thought of that one??? - Just a minute two names spring to mind in Liverpool. <br /><br />Absolutely ludicrous.<br /><br />No further comment.<br /><br />Kinga GrzeczynskaKinga Grzeczynskanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4598228705498900088.post-79369750278750265262012-04-12T12:39:06.167+01:002012-04-12T12:39:06.167+01:00Because of these abuses, my wife and I only attend...Because of these abuses, my wife and I only attend the Extraordinary Form of Mass on Sundays and Holydays. It usually involves a lot of travelling.<br /><br />Until we get bishops confident enough in their theology and authority to stop the rot, these abuses will continue. Brave priests do their best, but without episcopal backing it is very hard for them.<br /><br />I know that it is impolitic to do so, but I begin to wonder if we should name and shame the parishes where the worst of these abuses occur. I realise that it would be inapproriate (or maybe unwise for fear of retribution) for priests to do so, but lay people can surely do so and help turn the ship around.Tomnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4598228705498900088.post-71995910840221357612012-04-12T08:10:15.125+01:002012-04-12T08:10:15.125+01:00Anarchy Rules OK,
I take it you have written to y...Anarchy Rules OK,<br /><br />I take it you have written to your parish priest and copied the letter to your bishop??Jacobinoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4598228705498900088.post-79292826400091769282012-04-12T00:02:04.646+01:002012-04-12T00:02:04.646+01:00I have never received Holy Communion from a lay pe...I have never received Holy Communion from a lay person and never will. I stopped attending Mass on Ash Wednesday when lay people started administering the ashes. I stopped attending Mass on Corpus Christi and Maundy Thursday when they became showcases for the EMHCs. In my parish it was like the march of the Siamese children as they all walked forward on to the sanctuary to renew their vows.<br />On checking this week's parish bulletin I see there are 20 'services' listed from Monday to Friday. Nine of these are daily Masses, two are Requiems,and 9 are listed as 'celebration of the Word and Holy Communion'. <br />Why is it when laypeople have the title 'extraordinary', they are many in number, but when a Mass is described as such it is a rarity?Anarchy Rules, OK.noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4598228705498900088.post-83514930198497102492012-04-11T23:31:04.664+01:002012-04-11T23:31:04.664+01:00Fr.,
You rightly raise the problem of EMHCs or as...Fr.,<br /><br />You rightly raise the problem of EMHCs or as I prefer to call them, lay distributers of Holy Communion since they are in no sense "ministers" of the Church. <br /><br />They are overwhelmingly people of good intent but their continued and routine use is a growing abuse in the Church.<br /><br />The real problem, however, and you have touched on it, is the willingness of parish priests to concede to them, and other busybodies such as self-appointed permanent parish councillors, authority which they do not have<br /><br />Priests ought to realse that it is they who are in charge of a parish and have the God-given responsibility for the spritual well being of parishioners.<br /><br />The strength of the busybodies is but a reflection of the abandonment of responsibhilities by the parish priest, not to mention the bishop of course!Jacobinoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4598228705498900088.post-77962528705701648162012-04-11T21:31:54.762+01:002012-04-11T21:31:54.762+01:00Yes, Father, it is now seen as a layperson's r...Yes, Father, it is now seen as a layperson's right to be "ordained" and will be taken to the limits by pushy parishioners overwhelming solo priests. This could never have happened in the days when vocations produced two or three priests per parish.<br />The sense of entitlement, it seems to me, has been encouraged by the bishops and will not lightly be given up.<br />I have noticed over the years that, whenever I attend a NO Mass at a church I haven't visited for a while, the same few people of a certain age are readers, collectors, bringers of gifts and EMHCs. They like to be styled "ministers". And the congregations keep falling. <br />Not long ago I went to Sunday Mass where the liturgy was flexible to say the least. At the end a middle-aged woman went up to the lectern (modern church) and proclaimed in high dudgeon how shocking it was that once upon a time only priests were allowed to touch the Host. I guess she was drumming up support for more "ministers" but I didn't hang around to find out.<br />So, so sad.Gentyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05569143943867323153noreply@blogger.com